318 | Transforming a Simple Idea into a Business | with Liam Eriksson

Liam Eriksson

Don't look at the dropshippers out there. Don't look at the get rich quick schemes. It's like just finding something that you really like and start selling. 

Chase Clymer

Welcome to Honest Ecommerce, a podcast dedicated to cutting through the BS and finding actionable advice for online store owners. I'm your host, Chase Clymer. And I believe running a direct consumer brand does not have to be complicated or a guessing game.

On this podcast, we interview founders and experts who are putting in the work and creating real results. I also share my own insights from running our top Shopify consultancy, Electric Eye. We cut the fluff in favor of facts to help you grow your Ecommerce business. Let's get on with the show. 

Chase Clymer

Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of Honest Ecommerce. Couldn't wait to get this one started. I'm welcoming to the show a co-founder and CEO of GUY FOX, Liam Eriksson. Welcome to the show.

Liam Eriksson

Chase, thank you so much for having me, my man. 

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. I'm excited to chat. You couldn't wait to get started. And we're just winging it, folks. I was trying to do the pre-interview and he said, let's just do it. So here we are. 

Liam Eriksson

Let's just go live, man. 

Chase Clymer

First, I always like to shout out when I meet people at conferences and stuff. And I think this is the first interview I've done of folks I met down at the Surf Expo in Orlando. So shout out Surf Expo in Orlando. 

Liam Eriksson

Shout out. 

Chase Clymer

That was one of the best trade shows I've gone to historically. It was great to meet you. You actually got this hat there as well. There's a bunch of other amazing brands. So foreshadowing, maybe this founder will be on the show. 

Liam Eriksson

There you go. But yeah. 

Chase Clymer

For those that don't know, what is GUY FOX? What are the types of products that you guys are bringing to market over there? 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah. So GUY FOX, our old tagline is that we want to be the most reliable fragrance brand in the world. We specialize in men's fragrances that could be cologne, candles and car scents. Those are kind of like our trifecta. We're mostly known for our men's cologne. 

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. Now, let's just go back to the beginning. Take me back in time. Paint me a picture. Where did the idea for this business come from? 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah, for sure. So we're based in San Diego. But my future co-founder and my best friend is named Grant. We actually went to college together in Sonoma State, which is the heart of the west, up in Northern California.

It is not Harvard. It's quite easy to get into. But we like to say that just because it's very ironic. So the story goes in GUY FOX's lore that in 2014, I was a senior in college and as a senior in college, number one, you don't know what you're doing in your life. 

And two, if you're a business major, you always think you're going to come up with the next business idea. That always resonated with me whether it be doing random things around the house or coming up with random new ideas. So I worked at a hotel and I ran out of cologne.

And I work alone, but I wasn't obsessed with cologne. I didn't really have any affinity towards it. I just liked it. You know, it made me feel a little bit more confident. I wore a suit to work. I'm 21. So I look kind of out of place at this nice hotel. I was like a concierge in front desk and not knowing really anything about wine like how to train myself. So I just knew I liked it. I knew girls liked it and I knew I got compliments here and there. 

And so in 2014, where do you go when you run out of fragrance? I went to Macy's. So I drove my car to Macy's and I walked in and I remember that whole experience being like the worst experience ever, right? We all walked past the Macy's fragrance counter. 

You get sprayed a ton of times, like you get a headache, you have a pushy saleswoman that's kind of selling you on products that you don't even know. And I walked out of there with a $130 bottle of a cologne I couldn't even pronounce. And so on the walk back to my car.

I was like, in my head, I was like, did I just black out? Like, how would I don't even have $130? Why am I spending it on something that's not necessary? And in college, we like, in my head, I always equated $10 to a meal. 

So I was like, oh, that's like 13 meals. I was like, there's no way. So I actually walked back into the store and returned it. And I think I bought it on Amazon or a cheaper one on Amazon that would arrive back in 2014, it would arrive like a week later or something. And so I was willing to forgo the delay to save a ton of money. 

On the drive home, I literally in my head, I was like, man, I'm a pretty good buyer. Like my friends would ask me, like, what, Liam, where do you get that shirt or those chinos or whatever that may be? And I probably consider myself a pretty confident men's buyer. And I was like, well, if that whole experience sucks for me and I kind of know fragrances a little, but I know how to buy like how is it for Chase or any of my other friends out there that all have a bottle of cologne?

But don't know what's in it, who makes it, and why is it expensive? And so that idea stuck with me for quite some time. So not to bore you with details or any listeners with details, but I started my career in San Francisco, worked in tech sales, did the whole thing, had an awesome experience with different startups. But that idea was always like a million dollar idea in my head. And in 2018, I actually saved enough money to actually get started with GUY FOX and the rest is history.

Chase Clymer

Absolutely.

Liam Eriksson

So one bad trip to the mall led to now we're one of the fastest growing men's fragrance brands in the country. So it's a fun story to tell. I've said it so many times, but yeah, man, it's a long road since then. 10 years actually. It's been 2014, 20, 24.

Chase Clymer

Yeah, I know. Well, now we're up to 2018. Now, how did this go from an idea, I want to start a fragrance line so you have your first sample in your hand? What was that about? 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah. So honestly, coming down to confidence, to be honest. So when I'm 21, I don't really know anything. I'm like, I want to move to a big city and hopefully make money and yada, yada, yada. And as my career progressed in tech, I was like, man, I'm good at what I do.

I like what I do, but it's not necessarily something I'm super passionate about. I like consumables. I like things that are physical. SaaS products are fine, but not necessarily anything I want to invest a ton of money in in my time. Cold-calling is in my nature. So I just cold-called a ton of labs across the country that focus on fragrances. 

And what happened is that I realized that the whole industry is quite small, actually. And what I found out is that there's only three companies that completely dominate the fragrance industry. And so when you walk into Macy's like I did, all of those fragrance brands that you think are actually owned by Gucci or YSL or even Le Labo, for that matter, all of them actually aren't even owned by those brands anymore. They just license out their names. And so there's only three companies that completely dominate in price fix.

And have those crazy ads of Adam Drawer, black and white coming out of the ocean that I just don't resonate with, that my guys don't resonate with. So once I found that out, I was like, OK, well, why don't I just work directly with the same perfumers that make those fragrances on behalf of those brands? And so we did. And so we were able to start with a really cool perfume house here in the United States. And they gave us a shot. I started with six fragrances, all named after my best friends. 

Like I was trying to figure out names and I was like, wait, why don't I just like, I don't know, just name them for my best friends. That's a cool story to tell. I love to honor them. And their names are pretty unique and cool. So we stayed true to that and started with six fragrances in 2018. And the whole idea when we first started Chase was not to necessarily be in stores. 

Our whole idea was to be like the anti-cologne cologne company. And we still kind of are where we don't follow the rules, but we really wanted to pride ourselves on quality and convenience and affordability. So those are kind of our three pillars and still are today. 

And so the idea is that you should go on our website in 2018 and you'd get a starter kit. And that starter kit would include samples of our best sellers and a code to redeem for your full-size bottle later. So instead of you going to the mall and you blind buying a fragrance, the idea is that Chase gets to try all these fragrances at home first, you, your partner, your friends, you guys get to choose what you like the best.

Then you just get the full-size bottle later. So it's like a try before you buy things. So that was our idea. And that's what we're really excited about. And that's what we did for the first 3 years in business. We focused on like, hey, try these out and then get your full-size bottle kind of thing. 

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. Just to put a timeline to this because I like to always point this out for younger entrepreneurs. These things take time. And you're like, I'm taking this seriously. How long was it till you had that thought to where you had a sample in your hand? 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah. Like a finished sample? Like we're ready to go? 

Chase Clymer

Well, finished. There's an asterisk. The first sample. 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah. So okay. So how would it work? People always ask, how do you even make fragrances? So I would get off work and I'd go to Sephora and I'd try all these fragrances. And I didn't know anything about them. I would just be like, okay, like Gucci Guilty, I like these notes that I think. I'd have to Google what oak moss smelled like, right? 

I was like, yeah, like, I think I like that or it's fresh or whatever. And so then I write notes and then when we were able to work with that perfumer or that perfume team here in the United States, they were able to help me get off the ground and be like, oh, you like Gucci Guilty because of these elements. 

That's great. That's a good starting point. Let's riff off that. Okay, great. What other notes do we want to incorporate? What kind of vibe do we want to set? So to answer your question from the beginning, like first talk and getting kind of serious to actually receiving what it actually would smell like probably like 2 years. It took so long. 

Chase Clymer

Yeah. That's what I want to point out to folks. These things don't happen overnight. And it definitely takes some investment of time and energy. What about just calling around and figuring out there's only 3 major players in the space? How long did that take? 

Liam Eriksson

I knew that after that college idea, that whole experience at Macy's. But I was like, man, these are all brands. Why are these all the same price and they all have the same vibe? Maybe I thought it was just the industry. And then I found that out when I got real serious about it. So probably like, I don't know, like 2016. I was like, okay. Who's making this? 

Chase Clymer

How many calls did you make? 

Liam Eriksson

Dozens, I would say. It was funny because people really like the idea. I was like, hey, I want to come up with a millennial clone brand that you don't have to buy straight up and we want to price it at $50.

Plus shipping, so 60 bucks. But still, like really reasonable for sure. But yeah, it took forever, dude. For us to actually pay money for a PO and stuff, like it was number one, all the money I ever had. And then two, it's like, it takes so long to actually get that. And then when you have it, then you have all your inventory and you have no more money. And you're like, all right, now I have to sell all these products, which is obviously a different story.

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Chase Clymer

Let's fast forward now. The products you've got, you're ready to roll, you're launching the website. How do you get customers? How do you sell this thing? Obviously, we're going with the sample route idea. But how did you get people that weren't your friends and family to this website? 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah. What I wanted to do is do a Kickstarter campaign because that was the hot shit back in 2014. And so I already had the money for it. So Kickstarter is for money. But I wanted to parlay it for money as well as exposure.

So I had all like we had from this epic campaign actually to this day, it's pretty crazy that we didn't even have real products to sell. And the Kickstarter video is awesome. I think we raised like 10,000 bucks in three days, which was amazing. And we're like, oh my God, it was like friends, family, as you can imagine, which was amazing. And then when we went live six months later, I was like, hey, how about we just and Meadow was kind of newish on ads. I was like, how about we just say like the ad is free samples.

Like free samples, and then hopefully someone buys the full size bottle later. Right. So what we did, our whole marketing campaign was that we had like really low ad spend. I'm talking like, I think like 10 bucks a day, if that, you know, like super low. We'd be like, get free samples. And we just, and we, I would make all these samples at home and like to write a handwritten thank you card. 

And the idea was that when you checked out, you just pay for shipping and we'd say like the shipping $7 shipping would be like $4 and then my unit costs would be like, let's just say $3 for like the little samples. 

So I'd be breaking even essentially on every single new customer. And the hope obviously would be for them to be converting to a higher bottle, which is the bigger price point. So we did that for like thousands of samples. The idea is like, who's going to trust us? We've never been on any blogs or press or whatever it may be. And so that really helped kind of get momentum of just brand new users and getting that user feedback. 

Chase Clymer

I mean, you said so much stuff here that's just brilliant that you can use. Obviously, if you're starting a cologne brand, but not even just beyond that, any sort of consumable men's or women's line. So free plus shipping, as a foot in the door sample offer, that stuff goes wild in the makeup space as well. 

And then just your funnel, you mentioned it earlier, and I'm gonna bring it back up, which is just like these days, you're really pushing the sample pack and then asking them to convert it into a full-size bottle after the fact. 

Because I think a lot of people, especially now with ads being expensive as hell, get caught up in trying to build out ads for each product, especially when you're bringing people to a new brand that they're not as familiar with. 

And especially when you have different fragrances or flavors, etc. Sample packs get rid of the decision in the process because there's analysis per hour. So you got 12 things and I'm not familiar. Most people are just going to balk and be like, I don't know. And then they're done. But if you're like, try them all at once for this price, then people are like, it's a lot easier to ask. 

Liam Eriksson

Oh, for sure. You hit that spot on. And to go off your point too. So when we first started, I guess I said it incorrectly. When we first started, you get a sample pack. You can choose or those are free, or you can get all six of them. And we call it the six box or something. 

As of last year, obviously, costs like acquisition cost have been huge and grown. And our ads are more efficient, but the costs are higher. It's just like kind of the worst tax of all time now with Meta. But really, like our only way to market to the masses and ease. 

Anyway, so now. We turned off the sample sets, which is like you get like all of them and then you try them later. And then we just push our starter kit. So we get your money upfront. So you give us 88 bucks and write great. No problem Chase. We got you. And we send you the sample kit and then you get a code to get for your full size bottle later. So still less than 90 bucks and you get all of them to try. 

So the process is great. It's just we get your money upfront because as a business, we can not like the conversion rate from people doing sample sets. Hopefully buying wasn't as great where we could just be like, I'm just going to force Chase to buy it because we know he's going to be happy. Right. Our return rate is less than 1%.

So like I say that jokingly, not jokingly, but I'm super proud of that because every flavor, right, we have 10 fragrances. If you don't like all 10 of them, like we are just not a good fit and you could totally have your money back. It'll, of course, have a 30 day money back guarantee. 

But I use that to say like, it was kind of fast-forwarding a lot of years, but it just gave us a lot more confidence when we're like, how about we just give them one option, rather than being like, hey, Chase, you could buy the sample set for 35 bucks. You get the starter kit for 88. You could also just get a couple free 2ml samples, individuals for 6. I'm like, no. Everyone just gets the starter kit or buys the full-size bottle. And that's changed. 

Chase Clymer

Yeah. Just simple fly stuff. 

Liam Eriksson

Exactly. And back to what you said, analysis process, bro, with guys. Dude, we're the worst. We don't know anything. We're the worst purchasers of all time. And so for us, let's just make it as easy as possible, as you said. So literally look at our website and be like, okay, I'm going to choose this. And we're good to go. 

Chase Clymer

Yeah. I mean, it's also just like retargeting and building landings. It's just like, you only have to do one thing well. And you can just keep optimizing that one thing. 

Liam Eriksson

Yes.

Chase Clymer

We jumped around there because we got excited about the offers. Is there anything else in this journey that you think is worth highlighting? 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah. There's a lot. What are some highlights? I had a full-time job. I literally had a full-time job for 3 full years. So I was at my startup. And then I was one of their top AEs, account executives. And then I finally got enough money to take it full time. And that was probably one of the most nerve-wracking experiences, to be honest. 

Because starting the company obviously is huge. And that zero to one is huge. But me taking it full time, me not having benefits, me paying my rent in San Diego and I'm living downtown, it's a huge, huge risk to pay my rent with things that smell good. So now I tell my team, it's just like, guys, nothing is too serious. We sell things that smell good. That's it.

Obviously we have bigger stories and visions, but when we want to distill it, I don't know, I just, I think back to your point about how long did it take, dude? Dude, it took three years for me to go full time. Three full years. And I was working at nights, you know, sweating and writing handwritten thank you cards on the freaking San Francisco Muni bus, you know? 

I think people always want to be like, oh, this, you guys are killing it now. It's like, yeah, kind of, hopefully. It's just like the work that you put in. 

And our parents always tell us that, right? It's the work that you put in, hopefully, will lead to fruition later. That level of patience, I did not have. But the biggest superpower you could have as an entrepreneur, which I'm sure you appreciate with your other speakers on, it's like, you're just so naive. 

So I'm like, oh yeah, this is good. Dude, I'm going to go full-time tomorrow. And then three years later, I'm like, oh, okay, cool. So it's here now. 

Chase Clymer

I think that naivete. So many founders on the show are like, Oh, if I knew how hard it would be, I'd never do this. But I started it because I was dumb and didn't know. 

Liam Eriksson

Yeah, dude. And just thinking about all the stupid stuff you did is hilarious. It's like thinking about when you were a kid, right? You're like, I cannot believe I did that. Business is very similar to that. And then you become a grizzled old veteran like me, who's not cynical, but anything now that happens badly? 

I'm like, Oh yeah, of course. Of course that happened badly. I'm dealing with so many things right now. But what do we control now? And it's nice that I took a couple on the chin to be where we're at right now. So anything that comes up, we just have this huge production delay that we never saw. We ran into something similar two years ago. So it's all good. We got it. It just wraps. 

Chase Clymer

Yeah. It's like, as long as no one's dead, you can figure it out. I think that a lot of entrepreneurs, again, talking about analysis paralysis from the entrepreneur side, they always get caught up in this idea of making the perfect choice. None of them are perfect choices. Even if you make the wrong choice, you can just change your mind. 

Liam Eriksson

Literally, dude. Yeah. No, I think we overcomplicate business. And that's my main thing. And I've said it on other podcasts too. When you first start a business, my biggest gripe is that I think I'm a fairly decently smart individual. Not the smartest. But I put in the work to get smarter and educate myself more about things. 

But especially in San Francisco, I was like, dude, I was next to people like that literally went to Harvard. Like my last boss went to Harvard and Stanford and my last CEO was Stanford. 

I think I created this crazy thing in my head where I like, you're not worthy or you need to kind of do it. All these people are using these acronyms that actually don't make sense. The only thing that you need to do as a founder is know who your customer is, hopefully your customers yourself. 

All I need to do is create products or services that I can resonate with and I can create for myself. And I think we just make it way too complicated purposely, right? To kind of almost gatekeep. But like, dude, business is so simplistic. Like we got like I got audited by CFA the other day, paid him thousands of dollars. 

He's like, yeah, your GUY FOX looks good. I was like, great. Thanks. You know, like, that's it. I'm like, oh, because I know my business. I know what it is. But it's not like that. It's revenue minus how much shit you've paid for. Marketing cogs equals your profit. There's not a fancy equation. But I like to put that on the record. It's not that complicated. 

Chase Clymer

No, not at all. 

Liam Eriksson

And we should stop making it complicated. 

Chase Clymer

Awesome. I really enjoyed this interview, Liam. Before we go, is there anything else that you want to leave with our audience? 

Liam Eriksson

No, this was the fastest podcast of all time, which I appreciate. No, I think the biggest thing is for your aspiring entrepreneurs or anyone listening out there, it's like betting on yourself. I know that sounds lame and cliche, but just try it. I think one of the biggest regrets in your life is not trying things. 

I always started the company. I was flying over South Africa and I was thinking about this idea that stayed with me for about time, seven years. And I wrote in my Apple Notes, I was like, Liam, you don't need to be the next Steve Jobs. You just need to be the next successful entrepreneur.

And that to this day, it's in my phone. It's screenshotted at that time. And yeah, I think just trying it, man. And being super stoked about things that you truly like is the only thing I really care about. Don't look at the dropshippers out there. Don't look at the get rich quick schemes. It's like just finding something that you really like and start selling. And that's it. 

Chase Clymer

Awesome. Great, great words to end on. Now, if I'm listening to this and I want to check out the products, where should I go? What should I do?

Liam Eriksson

guyfox.com or guyfoxco on Instagram. Oh, and we're in stores. Go to our website. You can look at our store locator. We're in 325 stores nationwide. 

Chase Clymer

Awesome. Liam, thank you so much for coming on the show today. 

Liam Eriksson

Thank you, Chase. 

Chase Clymer

We can't thank our guests enough for coming on the show and sharing their knowledge and journey with us. We've got a lot to think about and potentially add into our own business. You can find all the links in the show notes. 

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Until next time!