Designing Emotional Touchpoints With Thoughtful Products | Monica and Rod Kosann | Monica Rich Kosann

Monica Rich Kosann is an internationally recognized fine jewelry brand based in New York. Rooted in the idea that every woman has a story to tell, the collection encompasses lockets, rings, necklaces, bracelets, and earrings that inspire and empower the wearer. 

The eponymous label was founded in 2004 by Designer and Chief Creative Officer Monica Rich Kosann–member of the Council of Fashion Designers of America–as an extension of her passion for fine art photography and storytelling. She runs the company with her husband Rod, who serves as CEO.

A Certified B Corporation working to meet the highest standards of quality and excellence, Monica Rich Kosann crafts sustainable heritage pieces that are made ethically and responsibly. The brand is sold in over 120 retailers across the country, has three free standing stores - two in New York and one at Somerset Collection in Troy, a shop at Bergdorf Goodman and a robust direct-to-consumer business. 

Designed using 18K Yellow Gold and Sterling Silver, Monica Rich Kosann designs precious gemstones and diamonds to ensure quality that lasts from generation-to-generation as modern heirlooms. 

A favorite with celebrities, Monica Rich Kosann pieces have been worn by incredible women throughout the years including Kelly Clarkson, Allison Williams, Sarah Jessica Parker and Gisele Bundchen.

In This Conversation We Discuss: 

• [00:00] Intro
• [00:37] Sponsor: Taboola
• [01:54] Inspiring growth through authentic vision
• [06:58] Persisting through early business rejection
• [10:11] Building momentum through supportive communities
• [11:10] Sponsor: Next Insurance
• [12:41] Diversifying channels to reach more customers
• [16:32] Callouts
• [16:42]  Enhancing products through storytelling
• [21:00] Strengthening brands through right partnerships 
• [24:02] Sponsor: Electric Eye
• [25:10] Building dedicated teams that enjoy their craft
• [26:19] Focusing business principles around your “Why”
• [28:02] Finding your unique approach and sticking with it

Resources:

• Subscribe to Honest Ecommerce on Youtube youtube.com/c/HonestEcommerce?sub_confirmation=1
• Lockets, fine jewelry, and luxury gifts monicarichkosann.com 
• Follow Monica Rich Kosann linkedin.com/company/monica-rich-kosann 
• Follow Rod Kosann linkedin.com/in/rodkosann 
• Reach your best audience at the lowest cost! discover.taboola.com/honest  
• Easy, affordable coverage that grows with your business www.nextinsurance.com/honest  
• Schedule an intro call with one of our experts electriceye.io/connect  

If you’re enjoying the show, we’d love it if you left Honest Ecommerce a review on Apple Podcasts. It makes a huge impact on the success of the podcast, and we love reading every one of your reviews!

Transcript

Chase Clymer

What advice would you give to folks out there looking for either a co-founder or a business partner outside of their husband or wife? 

Monica Kosann

What's really important, no matter who you're connected to, I think a sense of humor is really important. You can stick to your guns so much and you have to have, you have to have mutual respect. So whether it's your husband or your business partner, I think mutual respect is also really important.

Chase Clymer

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Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of Honest Ecommerce. Today I'm welcoming to show not one but two amazing founders. They're joining us from Monica Rich Kossan. It is Monica and Rod, the CCO and CEO respectively of c. Welcome to the show. 

Monica Kosann

Thank you for having us, Chase. We're very excited to be here and be together doing this. 

Chase Clymer

Wow. I'm excited too.I guess, let's just take me back in time. You have been doing this for over 20 years now. What was the impetus for starting your own jewelry line? When did that idea just take hold and you really start to take it seriously? 

Monica Kosann

Well, it was really more of an evolution, not necessarily a revolution. How we started, my roots are in photography. And I was doing photography for a very long time and I was always a storyteller when I approached my clients. I did private commissions, I did a lot of celebrities, high net worth people. I just kind of traveled all over, but no matter who you were, I always wanted them to tell their story and never asked them to smile. 

I would spend a day with them in their natural surroundings. And at the same time, I was very inspired by photographers of the early 1900s. Which was Stieglitz and Steichen and Gertrude Casabier, and they were really the first photographers to photograph daily life and make photography beautiful and not document anything. Just sort of like creating beauty out of the everyday. 

And that was what I was trying to create to my photography and at the same time i also love vintage lockets and old cigarette cases and powder compacts and i used to collect a lot of these old pieces and eventually what i started to do is take my clients photos and put them into the lockets and give them a gift with a locket with their family photo in it or old cigarette case or powder compact and put their photos in it.

It was really my customers who were my inspiration and they were like, these are beautiful modern day heirlooms. I love the idea that there's so much history. And this goes back in time and you're making me a new modern day heirloom today. And they're the ones that inspired me and loved it and kept asking me for more. And it was kind of that “aha” moment. 

I think I went back to the studio and I probably said to you, Rod, “You know there's something here.” We started with little cases but we eventually got into the lockets. Because I think lockets are the sexiest piece of jewelry a woman can wear. It was sort of a gateway into storytelling and it held you know a woman's secrets and it held things close to her heart. And all the lockets out there were like for grandmas.

You know, I wanted lockets that my niece could put a meme in. My daughters could put their dogs in. You know, I wanted it to be more of a secret message holder and I wanted it to be a cool piece of jewelry that a woman can hold her stories in and her celebrations and milestones. And Bergdorf Goodman was our very first client and that's how it started. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah, it came from a really authentic place. I mean, I think it wasn't, we didn't sit down and try to map out a jewelry business. It really just came from this very authentic story. And I think what happened is after we started with the lockets, because it was Monica's point. I think she saw, we saw, we both saw the opportunity to kind of reinvent it for a new generation. And then what really became obvious to us after a couple of years is we weren't necessarily just in the locket business. We were in the storytelling business. 

And we were in this business of personalization and inspiring people based on these secret things that they would put into a locket. And what that grew into was more collections that were based on meaning. That was based on storytelling, that started to tell the client's story instead of telling our story necessarily as a luxury brand. So it was this really interesting, authentic evolution that really launched the brand. 

And then when we actually started, I think if you had said to us, we would be sitting in the luxury fine jewelry business. With this multifaceted distribution of channels and whatnot 20 years from now. I'm not even sure we could have imagined it at the time. So it really was a nice authentic story. 

Chase Clymer

That's amazing. Well, you have already inspired me. uh I actually really enjoy old things as well. And I was like, wow, do I need another thing to collect. And vintage cigarette cases might be something I started looking for.

Monica Kosann

Totally. Totally. 

Rod Kosann

Shama and I have been to every flea market... 

Monica Kosann

All over the world over the last 10 years. Yeah. 

Chase Clymer

And it's very, we're kind of spirits. My first love was photography as well. It's what I went to school for. Before I eventually... 

Monica Kosann

I didn't know that. Amazing. 

Chase Clymer

Dropped out for my second love, which was music. We can talk about that a bit more after the show. But now, you are inspired and you want to bring a new modern flair to these vintage elements. And your flagship product is Lockets. How do you get that first client? And not the, or I guess buyer or customer, if you want to call it. It's a pretty notable customer. How did that all happen? 

Monica Kosann

Well, in full transparency, Chase, they said no.

Chase Clymer

Most do. 

Monica Kosann

When I first went to them, I went directly to the buyer at Bergdorf's. And I remember the phone call and I remember him saying, “You know, I don't know if you really need something like that.” And I'm like, “Oh, but you do.” Because in those 20 years ago, 21 years ago, there really wasn't personal jewelry. There really wasn't anyone doing that, creating pieces that told the customer story, not my story, but told the customer story. 

So I remember hanging up the phone and saying, “I'm sorry, I am not taking no for an answer.” There's no way. And I called him back. I remember this conversation so well. And I literally said to him, “You have to give me a chance. I'm telling you, this is, it's going to do phenomenal.” I promise you just give me a chance. I started on a little pad as big as a place map.

And he was kind of like, okay. I think I just, I just did not let up. And he was kind of like, “Oh my God, let's just keep this woman quiet.” He’s like, “Okay, let's give her a pad, go do your thing.” They let me do it, which, to their credit, was amazing. They gave me the chance and I really seized it. And it became over time a 400 square foot space at Bergdorf Goodman.

And I always say that, and actually Rod always tells everyone, Monica. I used to say it's my garden. So I was tending to it. That was my garden. And I was in charge of the one store and then Rod and the team were in charge of the 150 other doors. But Monica was in charge of our Burg doors. I didn't take no for an answer. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah, it was. When we started, it was a very traditional wholesale strategy. And we went to the independent jeweler and Monica's point that the joke used to be that she had one account. I had 99. And when we…

Monica Kosann

I said 150, sorry. 

Rod Kosann

In the early days, the first year we started over at our garage and it wasn't about emails and it wasn't about texts. It was about making phone calls and then once nobody picked up, don't leave a voice mail. Just call back again three hours later. 

A lot of it was we had this nugget of an idea about personalization to find jewelry. And we were really fortunate that we were. As we put this in front of the independent jewelry community, they responded to it in a really positive way and gave us a chance and gave us an opportunity. So that was kind of the starting point. 

It started, really, with this very classic traditional wholesale model. We were self-financed. We're still self-financed today. So this was always doing it more the old-fashioned way. And that was the journey. 

Chase Clymer

I hear from some businesses that having a similar approach starting wholesale was the way that they went. And they alluded to that there was a domino effect to it. Once you get one start, all fall into place and the more you get. The easier it is to get more. Is that what you felt or did you have a different experience? 

Rod Kosann

The independent jeweler community is a really beautiful community of people. A lot of these people have long-standing businesses. They know each other. They respect each other's decision making. They talk to each other. 

Monica Kosann

Yeah, they talk to each other. 

Rod Kosann

So it is really nice because if one store has a nice experience with you, they will share that with others in other communities around the country. So it definitely does start to get easier once you get to build this nice base. And hopefully with success, they share that success and word of mouth. Because each of them are in their own individual communities trying to service those communities.

Chase Clymer

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Monica Kosann

Yeah. And I think that we're also very... Rod and I, we're very loyal people and the people we work with are loyal. Some of the wholesale stores we've been with since the beginning, we're still with them. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah. Some of those customers are still customers today. 

Monica Kosann

Yeah. 

Rod Kosann

It's really nice. 

Monica Kosann

Yeah.

Chase Clymer

That's amazing. When did you start to diversify the channels? And when did the dot com become more of a key player in the business?

Rod Kosann

Yeah, it's very interesting because we experimented with it very early. But these were the days too when a lot of the stores didn't. It was very new. People didn't understand it. They thought, “Well, gosh, if you're online, then you're going after our customer.” Our first website wasn't even called Monica Rich Kosann. 

We actually called it something else because we were trying to learn and experiment with it. I think we call it the fine art of family. And it was very much an experimentation because people didn't want to feel like you were in the retail business. Of course, over the first 10 years to 12 years of our business, the whole outlook started to change. As Ecommerce grew and as Ecommerce got better and bigger. 

And so it was probably about 10 years ago that we started to really say, “You know, we're really fortunate.” We know who we are as a brand. We've been able to define it better and better. These wholesale partners who we have who are just like really wonderful people have to serve a lot of masters. They have to tell a lot of stories. And part of the challenge is they can't tell every brand story the way every brand would like it to be told. 

I think it's a universal challenge. And we just felt we know what the brand is well enough that if we can tell that story to the consumer directly then all the boats will rise. And maybe all of our customers might not recognize that right off the bat, but we do believe that with time they will see the value in that. And so it was probably around 10 to 11, 12 years ago that we started to make that pivot to this direct-to-consumer Ecommerce direction. 

And we really then over the first 3 or 4 years put more and more resources into that. And it really did become a defining part of our business. And the best part being that it allowed us to show the consumer and client what the brand really is. We know that brands walk in, consumers or clients walk into stores because they get that wonderful impression of the brand from our direct efforts. And say, “You know, what do you have from Monica Rich Kosann? Because I want to, I'd love to see the product.” 

So we really do believe that in the end, if we do our Ecommerce and direct jobs well that all the distribution votes will rise. 

Chase Clymer

I fully believe that too. I think some people in this ecosystem like to call it the halo effect where you invest in any one channel and you'll see it rise. They make the other channels grow as well. And it was interesting to hear you mention that when you started to look into exploring making your direct-to-consumer store more of a key part of the business, that your wholesale partners were a little wary of that. And you're not the first business I've heard that from. 

Heck, our clients have even told us before on the agency side. And I think that you're right. Now people understand that it's just the way it is. But about a decade ago, if you started to mention you were going to sell your own products online, you would, you were definitely getting pushback. 

Monica Kosann

Pushback 100%. Yeah. 

Rod Kosann

I had a lot of talks with people. 

Monica Kosann

I was just going to say, Rod used to have a lot of talks. That's a good way to put it. 

Rod Kosann

I was really fortunate. They all got provident to me. 

Monica Kosann

Yeah. But in the end, it was the right thing and it really served us. It really served us well. And I think everyone realizes it now. You have to do that. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah. And again, as we said, the overwhelming share of those customers are still customers today. And I think that it all puts the business in a better place. 

Chase Clymer

Hey everybody, just a quick reminder. Please like this video and subscribe if you haven't. We're releasing interviews like this every week. So don't miss out. Now back to the interview. 

What you said about you can tell the story the way that you want to tell the story and give it that best effort and it does drive that foot traffic to the store. Especially for a product like yours or similar products out there, where it's luxury and it's more of a considered purchase. They absolutely want to go and touch it. And the tactile feeling of trying something on and seeing it in real life is something that they can only do with these wholesale partners. 

There's these retail outlets, whereas it's a little more of a decision to make that investment blind online. So it does drive more traffic, I think, in stores when it is more of a considered purchase. 

Monica Kosann

And we do have an incredible luxury customer experience. We have The Locket Bar where a customer can either come to the store, or they could do it online in the privacy of their own home. They choose the locket that they're purchasing. And then we have a whole library of all of our lockets. They choose their locket. And it's literally three steps from your phone.

You pick your photo, or your meme, or quote, recipe, or flowers whatever you can screenshot you can put in your locket. And then it prints out, I like to say almost like you imagine a cookie cutter. Prints out and it's in the size of that particular locket and you cut it out and you put it in yourself. Or if you're in one of our stores you know we do it for you. So it's great, it's a great luxury experience. 

And it's also, our brain really connects people. All about connecting and when you're in one of our shops or even if you're online or even in our wholesalers. Our wholesalers have access to the Locket Bar as well. It just really, unfortunately or fortunately, however you look at it, our lives are on this. I'm holding up my phone, right?

And when a customer starts going through their camera roll and you start talking to the salesperson or even if you're in the privacy of your own home, it gets nostalgic. And you get this warm feeling and it just feels like home. And that's such a great layer to our brand. 

Rod Kosann

I mean, I think that's like one of the things we really wanted to do was not just have the product, or the great design. We wanted it to really be an experience. So very early on, we developed the software, which we've evolved over the last 15 years. Where it just becomes easier and easier to take that friction away. Because one of the frictions was, how does it? How do I get a photo? There was a day when you had to drop a photo into a Word document and try to keep manipulating the corners in order to get it to the right size so you could cut it out.

And we were able to create this software to take the friction out of that. And it really has created, to Monica's point, this wonderful connecting experience. Because I think what we all want with a client,what we all want is to find ways to make the client feel like they've had this amazing experience that has made them closer to us. 

And when you sit there in a store, when you talk with somebody about what they're going to put into their locket, it really becomes this wonderful connecting retail experience. And it really does lay the groundwork for that customer who wants to come back to the brand. And see more and do more, which is obviously the dream scenario that we all as brands try to aim for. It’s to allow customers to give us the privilege of being part of their life.

Monica Kosann

And when you think about it, these are… This is a cold object, this is an 18 karat gold or sterling silver object. And how a luxurious object like that can make you feel so warm and so connected and so cozy and nostalgic. And make you feel like you're wearing your story. I always call our pieces like your daily armor.

So almost like your tattoos for the day, except they're not permanent. So you can change it up every day. And they're just pieces that you wear to inspire you for the day or to make you feel good. And that's really the design ethos. And that's a philosophy which hasn't changed since I was a photographer. It was just another way to tell, for a woman to tell her story. 

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. That's amazing. And I do believe that it does give you that connection with your customers that the personalization is such a great way to build a better connection with your customer. But to pivot a bit, I do want to talk a bit about partners again, but not your wholesale partners. You and Rod, obviously, Monica, you guys are partners in this business. 

And I was lucky to find a great business partner in the partner that I have at my agency. You obviously are married as well. So that adds another layer of interest to this question. 

Monica Kosann

Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

Chase Clymer

What advice, I guess, first and foremost, what advice would you give to folks out there looking for either a co-founder or a business partner outside of their husband or wife?

Monica Kosann

I think that I know that we're married, obviously. But I think that's what's really important, no matter who you're connected to. I think a sense of humor is really important. Really important. And I also think you have to know when to let something go.

You can stick to your guns so much. And you have to have mutual respect. So whether it's your husband or your business partner, I think mutual respect is also really important. 

Rod Kosann

I also think figuring out everybody's lane, this helps 90 % of the battle. And then, there's always going to be overlaps. I think Monica and I overlap a lot on just creative image and marketing and things like that. But, we can stay in very different lanes most of the time. 

And it is hard as spouses because it is sort of this 24 seven for them in your life. I think you, I would say to somebody who wanted to be partners. I would say, you really need to feel like you really trust that person and that you all and that you can consider them a friend. 

Monica Kosann

Oh, trust, obviously. Gosh.

Rod Kosann

You know a friend as well. I mean, Yeah, we're married, but I think we're friends. And I think that's really helpful because I think it can make... 

Monica Kosann

Aww, that was so sweet, Rod. 

Rod Kosann

There you go. That's your card. I love it when you. There you go, Chase.

Chase Clymer

No, no, no. You hit on everything that I thought you would. Obviously, I think staying in your lane, absolutely. I think trust is key. A sense of humor is something I never really thought about. But yeah, when things get hard, laughing about it and realizing. The best thing about entrepreneurship is usually life is not on the line. So it's not that serious. 

You can roll with the punches, you can make mistakes, you can figure something out. So that's the best part about it. And having a good sense of humor about it just makes the job worth doing.

Monica Kosann

Yeah. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah. 

Chase Clymer

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Monica Kosann

You have to enjoy what you're doing no matter what. I feel very strongly about that. And I was the same way with raising two daughters. We have two daughters. And if you don't wake up in the morning and love what you do then I don't know. I feel like you really need to respect what you do and enjoy what you do. And I think that's really important. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah. It also makes it as a business, as one business grows. We're really fortunate to have this amazing, very dedicated team of people who are really integrated. 

Monica Kosann

Yeah, 100%. Yeah. 

Rod Kosann

A lot of them have been with us for a long time. And some of them started out of school and they're running parts of the serious parts of the business, if not most of the business at this point. And I think the ability to build that sort of organization also just makes it easy for partners to stay focused on the things that they're supposed to try to do well in terms of strategic visions. And hopefully, going to business, to any business to the next level. So we've been really fortunate to have that. 

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. Now, is there anything I didn't ask you about that you think would resonate with our audience? 

Rod Kosann

I think one of the things that's interesting about the brand is when we started with the locket and started with the personalization and storytelling. I think what we really ended up starting to understand over the last 5 to 7 years is that, in the end, everything became about meaning. And if you actually look at all of our collections. We really ask ourselves, there's so much beautiful jewelry in the world. And we ask ourselves, “Why us?” 

Like, we think, that's just a great business principle. Why does the world need us? And we say that to each other in product meetings and design meetings all the time. And what really happened is that these collections with Monica's eye and taste and whatnot. They're a really beautiful product. And with our design team, they're really well designed. But they all mean something. 

And they all come from this place of meaning there is really something really interesting behind the collection. And our customer does understand it. We see it with the gift notes that they write, we see it when they give a gift to somebody. And so the brand, again, meaning was just another point of connection. And I think the challenge in this world of billion channels and a billion messages every single day is coming at us from all directions. It is really to find a space where you really can be differentiated and special. And this is what we think about all the time. 

Monica Kosann

Agreed. 

Chase Clymer

Yeah. And I'd like to just follow up on that to help all the younger entrepreneurs out there that are listening that want to do something. But maybe they don't have the... You don't need to have the next Facebook idea. But I mean this with all due respect. You're not reinventing the wheel with the actual product. It's storytelling. It's the connection with the customer. It's the taste, right? 

But it's a locket. What I want to tell the listeners out there is it's already existing in the market. But if you can find a more novel way to approach the product. Either in a storytelling perspective or in the way that it is solving the problem for your ideal customer, you can build a sustainable business.

Monica Kosann

I think that I just want to add that it started with the locket. It's a lot more, obviously. But I think that to add to what you just said, Chase. I think that if you have a point of view, I think that's really important. I think if you have a point of view, stick to it if you believe in it. And then eventually it can resonate. 

I think, what happens sometimes when you're starting a business and I have two daughters and two sons in laws. And so you everyone was at different stages, at different stages in their lives and everything. I think if you start to please or try to please everyone, that's a mistake. And I don't mean this dramatically. I just mean it's you just have to please yourself and do what you believe in and keep your point of view. And eventually it will get through the noise. 

If you start to try to please everyone, you'll never please everyone. Never. That's just, that's the world. You can never please everyone. So I always talk about the horses in the city. They have those things like this on their faces, blinders. When people ask me like, “What about this? And what about that? Monica, are you going to, they're doing this or they're doing that?” 

You know what? And I said the same thing when I was in my photography. I always stuck to my black and white. I just did what I wanted to do. I stuck to my point of view. I put the blinders on and I just move ahead. I persevere and hopefully someone will like it and hopefully someone will listen. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah. I mean, I think the “why” is a great guide for anyone who's starting. And also the other thing too is, I think when people start, they'll have a great idea.But the business they may end up being in five years later is dramatically... 

Monica Kosann

Yeah. 

Chase Clymer

Oh, yeah. 

Rod Kosann

And I'm sure you've heard this from so many people who you've talked to. 

Monica Kosann

Yeah. 

Rod Kosann

You know, our very first product wasn't actually the locket. It was actually one of these cigarette case type products that held photographs. Within a year, we pivoted more, started to pivot more to a jewelry direction. But sometimes that first idea will take you down a road that's a really special road.

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. And obviously, you want to listen to your customers. Well, like said, you can't please everyone. There tends to be, the bad customers are sometimes louder than the good ones. And you need to be able to recognize that. Just an off the head example, especially if you're in a luxury space or a position where the products might be a little bit more expensive. Everyone's going to ask for it to be cheaper, but that might not be your customer. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah, absolutely. Yes. There's no question. 

Chase Clymer

And then to the blinders thing, that is something that comes up all the time in business books. Shiny object syndrome is what they call it. And traction. You understand traction and you set up the EOS model within your business, which… Research it more. We do it at our agency. Within that book, what they talk about is the idea of the issues list. And you add these shiny objects to the issues list. And if it's still important later on when you get back to it, maybe look into it. But 9 times out of 10, these things just fall off the list because they're not actually important. 

Monica Kosann

Yeah. Yeah. Good point. 

Rod Kosann

There's a lot of distraction and it's very easy to take it out of the box. 

Monica Kosann

There's a lot of noise. There's a lot of noise out there. Oh my goodness. 

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. Now if folks are listening to this podcast and they're like, “Yo, this locket sounds like a fantastic gift for my wife, my mother, my father, etc. Where should they go? What should they do? 

Monica Kosann

monicarichkosann.com for our stores or on our website. It has all the retailers in your local areas all over the country. 

Rod Kosann

Yeah, there's about 130-140 retail locations around the country. Mostly, we're wonderful independent jewelers. Yes, through our site. And then we have a couple of our own stores as well. So... 

Monica Kosann

Thank you for asking, Chase. 

Chase Clymer

Absolutely. Yeah. I thank you guys so much for coming on the show today, sharing all those amazing insights. 

Monica Kosann

Thank you. Thank you so much for having us.

Rod Kosann

Well, thanks for having us, Chase. It was really fun. It was really fun. And yeah, really appreciate you having us on.